Filtru particule

[dorubimotoru]

Isi face regenerarea in timp ce stationeaza ?

 

Octavia face .....la Bmw nu stiu ce face!!!

[WIN60]

la grupul VAG isi face regenerare si in stationare fara probleme, pur si simplu, porneste regenerarea, astepti sa se termine si dupa poti opri linistit masina ca si-a facut regenerare completa cu succes.

[bimmer90f30]

Isi face regenerarea in timp ce stationeaza ?

Mai precis spus regenerarea e terminata daca se sta cu motorul pornit acel timp pana se termina.

Regenerarea nu va incepe pe loc, cel putin nu in mod normal.

 

Si BMW face aceasta regenerare la destinatie.., cel putin asa am inteles pe ceva forumuri din USA pana sa ma decid sa iau un E90.. Mi se pare ca sunt si ceva clipuri pe youtube aratand asta..

 

Se mai spune ca regenerarea pe loc ar putea fi incompleta. Altii spun ca aceasta ar putea continua (avand in vedere ca probabil in esapament se afla deja o cantitate nearsa de combustibil) de indata ce sunt indeplinite conditiile prealabile..

Edited March 28, 2018 by bimmer90f30

[drujbex]

da, la VAG daca ai rabdare isi face si pe loc

sta intr'adevar turatia la relanti la 1000 si miroase foarte putin a ars, daca esti atent.

[WIN60]

E foarte bine, macar stii ca isi face si e bine ca isi face si in oras...la Bmw nimic pe oras si daca porneste e riscul sa strici mai rau DPF-ul oprind masina.

[CatalinP]

Fals, și la BMW se face regenerare ĂŽn oraș, chiar și pe loc, doar ca regenerarea optima e peste 70 Km/h.

[CatalinP]

System functions

 

Strategy regeneration of diesel particulate filter

 

As the diesel particulate filter has a limited capacity for loading with soot, the diesel particulate filter must be regenerated regularly. For this reason, the engine control unit determines the soot load on the diesel particulate filter. Regeneration begins when a specific limit of soot loading is exceeded.

 

The start of regeneration depends on the following parameters:

 

differential pressure in the diesel particulate filter

driving profile since the last regeneration

In order to oxidise the soot which has collected inside the diesel particulate filter, the exhaust-gas temperature must be raised to 580°C. Measures are integrated in the engine control to ensure that the exhaust temperature can be increased under all conditions.

 

Parameters adjusted and measured by the engine control via sensors as follows:

 

Hot film air mass meter

Coolant temperature sensor

Crankshaft sensor

Intake air temperature sensor

Ambient pressure sensor

Charging pressure sensor

Differential pressure sensor, diesel particulate filter

Exhaust-gas temperature sensor upstream of oxidation catalytic converter

Exhaust temperature sensor upstream of diesel particulate filter

Fuel pressure sensor

Gear engaged

Driving speed

Fill level in the fuel tank

Operation of the diesel particulate filter

 

Analysis of the differential pressure or exhaust gas pressure in the diesel particulate filter

 

The diesel particulate filter is equipped with a differential pressure sensor which continually monitors the current pressure difference. The soot load in the diesel particulate filter is determined on the basis of the differential pressure and the calculated exhaust gas mass flow.

 

The input variables are:

 

Exhaust gas mass flow (calculated on the basis of the measured air mass flow, the mass flow of the exhaust-gas recirculation and the fuel injection rate)

Exhaust-gas temperature before diesel particulate filter

Absolute internal pressure in the diesel particulate filter (calculated from the model for pressure in the exhaust emission system, the ambient pressure sensor and the differential pressure sensor or exhaust gas pressure sensor)

Analysis of the driving profile since the last regeneration

 

The DDE monitors the distance driven since the last regeneration. On the basis of this driving profile, a maximum distance travelled is calculated, after which distance, regeneration is activated.

 

The input variables are:

 

Heat-up of the diesel particulate filter

Regeneration of the diesel particulate filter

In regeneration mode, the diesel particulate filter is heated up. When the warm-up phase is completed, regeneration is started at a coolant temperature of over 60°C.

 

Warm-up phase

 

In the warm-up phase, the input variables are changed to achieve a heat-transmitting reaction in the diesel particulate filter. To do this, the air mass is reduced and the maximum point of combustion raised to achieve an increased exhaust-gas temperature.

 

Input variables are:

 

Air mass

Exhaust-gas recirculation rate

Charging pressure

Quantity and time of main injection and post-injection

Air swirl in the combustion chamber

When the temperature of the diesel particulate filter rises to above 400°C, switchover from warm-up phase mode to regeneration mode is effected.

 

Regeneration

 

In regeneration mode, the input variables are changed so that the exhaust-gas temperatures continue to rise to 580°C. This increase is achieved by a further reduction of the air mass and a further delay in combustion.

 

To achieve this, the following input variables are changed:

 

Air mass

 

The setpoint value of the air mass is calculated via the engine speed and the fuel injection rate. The setpoint value is adjusted in dependence on the ambient pressure to ensure stable combustion at various heights above sea level.

 

Exhaust-gas recirculation rate

 

The desired exhaust-gas recirculation rate is calculated on the basis of the engine speed and the fuel injection rate. In dependence on the ambient pressure and the intake air temperature, the setpoint value is adjusted so that stable combustion is ensured at various heights above sea level and at low temperatures.

 

Charging pressure

 

The desired charging pressure is also calculated on the basis of the engine speed and the fuel injection rate. The setpoint value for the charging pressure depends on the ambient pressure and the intake air temperature. It is set in such a way that at low temperature, stable combustion is possible and the maximum speed of the exhaust turbocharger is not exceeded.

 

Fuel injection pressure

 

The desired fuel injection pressure depends on the engine speed and the fuel injection rate.

 

Quantity and time of main injection and post-injection

 

Adjustments are made at low ambient pressure to ensure that the maximum permissible temperature for the exhaust turbocharger is not exceeded.

 

Air swirl in the combustion chamber

 

The setpoint value for the position of the swirl flap is calculated on the basis of the engine speed and the fuel injection rate.

 

Switch-off strategy for regeneration

 

Regeneration is only possible within defined limits for the coolant temperature, the exhaust-gas temperature and the ambient pressure. The cleansing effect of the diesel particulate filter is also maintained outside these limits. There is therefore no influence on the exhaust emissions.

 

The limits for switch-off of regeneration are defined as follows:

 

Coolant temperature between 60°C and 110°C

 

The lower limit for the coolant temperature is necessary to ensure stable combustion. The upper limit protects the engine against thermal destruction.

 

Exhaust-gas temperature between 220°C and 690°C upstream of the oxidation catalytic converter

 

The lower limit for the exhaust-gas temperature is necessary to achieve an adequate heat-generating reaction in the oxidation catalytic converter and in the diesel particulate filter. The upper limit for the exhaust-gas temperature protects the oxidation catalytic converter and the diesel particulate filter against excessive thermal load. The upper limit can only be exceeded in the event of engine malfunction.

 

Exhaust-gas temperature between 220°C and 670°C upstream of the diesel particulate filter

 

The lower limit for the exhaust-gas temperature is necessary to achieve an adequate heat-generating reaction in the oxidation catalytic converter and in the diesel particulate filter. The upper limit for the exhaust-gas temperature protects the oxidation catalytic converter and the diesel particulate filter against excessive thermal load. The upper limit can only be exceeded in the event of engine malfunction.

 

Ambient pressure greater than 0.6 bar

 

At lower ambient pressures, the maximum permissible speed of the exhaust turbocharger is exceeded and regeneration is therefore blocked.

 

Sursa: https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/f15-x5-xdrive30d-sav_201404/wiring-functional-info/power-train/digital-diesel-electronics/exhaust-re-treatment/system-diesel-particulate-filter/1VnXOUt5Pc

 

Aviz celor care elimina swirl flaps prin diverse metode.

 

 

Regeneration

 

There are two kinds of regeneration:

 

Continuous regeneration:

 

This form of regeneration takes place during normal driving. At exhaust-gas temperatures of between 280-350°C, continuous regeneration takes place in the form of a slow oxidation process. The soot particles cannot be incinerated until the exhaust gases reach the required temperature.

 

Periodic regeneration:

 

Periodic regeneration is performed automatically by the DDE after no later than 1000 km (600 miles). On vehicles with many short-distance drives, periodic regeneration already starts taking place after just 400 - 800 km (250 - 500 miles).

 

For regeneration, the intake air is reduced by the throttle valve. One or two post-injections are performed. This increases the exhaust-gas temperature to about 600 °C. The soot is incinerated with the residual oxygen.

 

The periodic regeneration is performed at all speeds. The most efficient method is regeneration at a constant speed in excess of 60 km/h (38 mph) over a period of 20-30 minutes.

 

The DDE calculates the time for periodic regeneration from the following values:

 

average distance travelled

average driving speed

temperature in the diesel particle filter

values from the exhaust gas pressure sensor

The last successful regeneration can be read out by the diagnosis system

 

The following conditions must be fulfilled for a regeneration:

 

The coolant temperature must be in excess of 75 °C

the exhaust-gas temperature before the diesel particle filter must be greater than 240 °C

there must be enough fuel (fuel reserve indicator light is not lit up). Whenever the reserve lamp lights up, the regeneration process is suspended.

no fault codes from the air mass system, exhaust emission system and sensors must be saved in the DDE

The fault codes 480A / 245700 (from F01) and 481A / 245800 (from F01) must display the status "currently not present"

Constant driving speed above about 60 km/h (approx. 38 mph). The optimum speed is about 100 km/h (approx. 60 mph).

 

Sursa: https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/f15-x5-xdrive30d-sav_201404/wiring-functional-info/power-train/digital-diesel-electronics/exhaust-re-treatment/system-diesel-particulate-filter/EZjPC6cq

[matose]

Fals, și la BMW se face regenerare ĂŽn oraș, chiar și pe loc, doar ca regenerarea optima e peste 70 Km/h.

 

Din experienta isi spun ca nu exista regenerare pe loc, doar regenerari partiale in mers sau complete la viteza peste 60 km/h. Oricum cu un DPF infundat e destul de greu sa pornesti regenerarea la BMW pentru ca primesti un 480A si nu se declanseaza. M-am plimbat vreo 3 ore cu un E87 luni ca sa pot sa pornesc regenerarea, cand a venit la mine avea presiunea la relanti de 60 mbar

[cristianpop2016]

Confirm ca regenerarea pe loc nu se face, pe drum spre casa a intrat in regenerare si ajuns acasa am zis ca dau o fuga pana sus si pe urma plec sa fac regenerarea, am lipsit 10 minute, diagnoza a ramas conectat pe masina si la intoarcere am vazut ca era oprita regenerarea, dupa plecare de pe loc si in timp ce temperatura pe evacuare a juns la 240 de grade regenerarea a reinceput sau continuat.

 

Dupa ce 2 saptamani am umblat cu dpff off azi in sfarsit am reusit si am gasit la un pret acceptabil un filtru bun, pus pe masina , rescris softul si plecat la drum sa fac regenrarea deoarece contrapresiunea era de 17 mbar la relanti, dupa prima regenerare fortata am vazut ca , km nu se reiau de la 0 iar regenerarea din enable sa facut disable, astfel incat am resetat dpff ca si unul nou, a intrat singur in regenerare si sa finalizat cu succes in prima parte, spun asta deoarece dupa regenerare contrapresiunea era intre 28 si 30 , foarte mare dupa mine, ajung la service inapoi si in momentul in care am oprit masina am observat ca senzorul cu motorul oprit citea 18 mbar, senzorii si cel de contrapresiune au venit cu filtrul, am pus la loc senzorul meu de pe masina si acum oscileaza intre 5.9 si 8.9.

 

Intr-un final esapamentul sa curatat si e din nou bec luna.

Nu am cautat alt filtru deoarece scotea fum, mentionez ca si cu dpff off nu scotea fum deloc, asta dupa ce am mai modificat tuningul putin si redus din debit, nu mai tragea cum tragea, dar cel putin nu scotea fum .

Edited March 29, 2018 by cristianpop2016

[Vik71]

Din experienta isi spun ca nu exista regenerare pe loc, doar regenerari partiale in mers sau complete la viteza peste 60 km/h. Oricum cu un DPF infundat e destul de greu sa pornesti regenerarea la BMW pentru ca primesti un 480A si nu se declanseaza. M-am plimbat vreo 3 ore cu un E87 luni ca sa pot sa pornesc regenerarea, cand a venit la mine avea presiunea la relanti de 60 mbar

 

sa intelg ca 480a este exclusiv dpf infundat ?

[matose]

DPF infundat sau senzor de presiune defect

[Vik71]

multumesc @Matose si aici si pentru cel de pe privat

acum vin de la reprez Apan Br si sunt ultra fericit dpf-ul e in stare de nota 10 la km ei [233k] , 480a s a resetat si l a ,,invatat,, inca 250.000 km , am asistat la testare cu valori de pe dpf si presiune la relanti si la 2000 rot/min [ 300 lei toata afacerea] dar stau linistit si cu 0 erori pe masina

acum doua zile am schimbat releu cu piesa pe original , bujii pe original full [ toate erau bune pe masina !] dar am zis sa nu ma tiganesc

Edited March 30, 2018 by Vik71

[drujbex]

480a are eroare una din masinile de care sunt interesat

 

in bord daca rulezi diagnoza aia a ei zice ca dpf e ok si mai are 15.000 km

 

masina are esapamentul luna, si eroarea e inregistrata cu sub 100km in urma

 

tre curatare chimica sau se poate forta regenerarea soft?

ma rog, dupa 30 min de mers urban, joi cand erau peste 15 grade, nu voia sa coboare sub 5 linii temperatura, deci probabil tre intai schimbate termistatele...

[matose]

Trebuie vazute presiunile inainte la filtru pentru a stii cat de infundat e

[bimmer90f30]

M-am plimbat vreo 3 ore cu un E87 luni ca sa pot sa pornesc regenerarea, cand a venit la mine avea presiunea la relanti de 60 mbar

 

Totusi de ce a durat 3 ore pana s-a regenerat? Ceva impresii din urma incercarii? Banuiesc ca prin tester ai incercat regenerarea.

[WIN60]

Pentru ca daca a avut probleme cu regenerarile si nu si-a facut, partial infundat, intra greu in regenerare.

Mai ales daca nu ai nici drumul pentru asta, trebuie sa mergi mai mult constant la viteza respectiva si daca ai ghinion sa pui o frana sa scazi viteza pe la 20 km/h...iarasi trebuie sa mergi si tot asa.

Edited March 31, 2018 by WIN60

[matose]

Totusi de ce a durat 3 ore pana s-a regenerat? Ceva impresii din urma incercarii? Banuiesc ca prin tester ai incercat regenerarea.

 

Pentru ca lua imediat eroare 480a si bloca regenerarea, stergeam eroarea si o luam de la capat. Dupa 3 ore am scazut backpressure in relanti de la 60mbar la 35mbar. Nu mai puteam sa stau, prin urmare am activat din nou regenerarea si omul a plecat singur pe autostrada. Deh, ai BMW te plimbi de nebun pe autostrada

[Luca_77]

Inainte de toate, verificati sau mai bine schimbati senzorul de presiune din filtru ca nu cumva sa transmita eronat catre ecu valorile si sa l bage tot timpul in regenerare. Daca masina trage bine si nu se limiteaza turatia, s ar putea ca acel zenzor sa fie problema!

[CatalinP]

Sunt 2 senzori, unul inainte si unul dupa filtru, ca doar se face o diferenta de presiune, pe baza careia se determina gradul de colmatare.

[matose]

Sunt 2 senzori, unul inainte si unul dupa filtru, ca doar se face o diferenta de presiune, pe baza careia se determina gradul de colmatare.

 

Unde ai vazut tu senzor dupa filtru?

[CatalinP]

The differential pressure sensor measures the pressure in the exhaust emission system upstream and also downstream of the diesel particulate filter.

 

https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/f15-x5-xdrive30d-sav_201404/wiring-functional-info/power-train/digital-diesel-electronics/exhaust-re-treatment/system-diesel-particulate-filter/1VnXOUt5Pc

[matose]

Ok, mi-l arati si mie in practica pe schema pentru ca nu il vad...

[OPaul]

Sunt 2 senzori de presiune, altfel nu imi explic cum poti sa ai o masuratoare precisa si sa functioneze corect sistemul...

 

Daca ai doar 1 senzor, la ce presiune il setezi sa declanseze regenerarea ? Vezi ca trebuie sa tii cont de presiunea atmosferica care se schimba zilnic in functie de vreme ,difera din loc in loc, si in functie de altitudine. Presiune atmosferica variaza cu 50-60mbar +/- fata de 0 (1000mbar) , ce este destul de mult si poate declansa asa de la sine o regenerare cand nu este cazul.

 

Asa daca sunt 2 senzori, scoti din ecuatie presiunea atmosferica (o valoare instabila de care nici nu ai nevoie) si nu mai conteaza ca acuma ai 980mbar si dupa o ora se face 1030mbar, regenerarea o sa se declanseze doar cand diferenta dintre cei 2 senzori depaseste o anumita valoare (35mbar in cazul asta).

 

 

Negru- conducta pentru presiunea dupa filtru

Rosu - conducta pentru presiunea inaintea filtrului

Albastru - cablul de la senzorul O2/temperatura

 

Cu un singur senzor nu mai aveai in ISTA valori de 10-30mb , ai fii avut presiunea atmosferica de la momentul citirii + presiunea care era inainte de filtru, o valoare de peste 1100mbar

Asa cu 2 senzori ai exact presiunea care te intereseaza, direnta dintre intrare si iesire , 5-10-20-30mbar etc.

 

Sper ca m-am facut inteles

[Florin044]

La mine nu exista senzor dupa filtru...

[WIN60]

Nici la mine:D